Q&A: Avery Cochrane Advocates for the Introverts and Overthinkers in “Shapeshifting On a Saturday Night”

MusicQ&A

Sep 3

INTERVIEW

“SHAPESHIFTING ON A SATURDAY NIGHT” TELLS US FITTING IN IS ABOUT MORE THAN CHANGING WHO YOU ARE. The pop anthem from newcomer Avery Cochrane is a revelation. Although it might only seem a representation of the girls who don’t like going out but still do in order to fit in, when we get closer to the message, there is a powerful subtext of radical acceptance. With beats reminiscent of current pop stars taking over the music industry, Cochrane explores a subject that isn’t often portrayed in music.

At 24 years old, the Seattle born and raised artist navigates identity and social norms. With singles such as “Corporate Ladder” and “Existential Crisis at The Golf Club,” she is on the way to establishing herself as a resonant singer-songwriter. “Shapeshifting on a Saturday Night” marks another step in the exploration of not adhering to normative life paths. While her previous singles focused more on strings and slower tempo, Cochrane shows her versatility with the upbeat switch.

Cochrane’s songwriting doesn’t leave unsaid words alone. She uses her growth as a person for her development as a musician, with “Shapeshifting on a Saturday Night” detailing an ideal version of herself who fits in with the status quo. Juxtaposing this version with who she truly is as a person, Cochrane unveils the truth about pretending, showing how heavy it can feel. The music video focuses on the relief of finding the freedom to accept who you are, and tells the listener that by being their authentic selves, they will attract the right people. Cochrane is comforting in her self-expression, and her art has the feat of making people who are afraid to speak up feel seen.

Luna talked to the artist about her recent release.

LUNA: How did you get into music?

COCHRANE: I started singing in choir. In middle school and high school, I had a jazz choir. I think jazz specifically was such a great genre to start with, because so much of it depends on improvisation and making mistakes and coming up with things as you go. I've taken a lot of what I've learned in jazz choir into my songwriting today. Then I went to school, and I kind of put music on the back burner a little bit. But when COVID hit, which was my freshman year, I was kind of, like, forced to do something other than school or do something to fill the time of being locked away in quarantine at 18 years old. I rediscovered my love for music and singing, and I've always written songs, but I started writing them to be released and recorded during COVID. That’s when I started a little less than five years ago, and it's just been non-stop ever since. I've been trying to do as much as I can, as often as I can since I started releasing.

LUNA: Was there a specific event that inspired “Shapeshifting on a Saturday Night?”

COCHRANE: No specific event, just a combination of a lot of different events that I've experienced over the last 24 years. I think the concept of shapeshifting can can be done in any context, starting from an early age - you do it on the playground to fit in with other kids, whether that's like being a mean girl or something because you think you want to fit in that way, or wearing something that you don't really want to wear. I feel like shapeshifting begins at a very early age to adapt into what you think society or your surroundings want. I just chose the concept of a Saturday night because I personally don't like going to the club at all; I hate it. But when I was in the college setting, or frat parties or the club, or whatever your friends are doing, I would feel like, I don't want to do this at all, and everybody's having a great time, what's wrong with me for not having a great time or not wanting to do this? And I like the alliteration of Shapeshifting/Saturday Night.

LUNA: That makes sense. The music video is very creative. Could you tell me more about the process of creating it?

COCHRANE: Yeah, that was some girl that I didn't know at the time. A stranger, an internet stranger, reached out to me and said, I love this, let me know if you want to make a music video. And she accidentally reached out to me on her spam account. So I was like, who's this random, private, no profile photo, with like 14 followers, and then she DM’d me the next day, and she said, Oh my god, it's so embarrassing, I DM’d you from my spam account, but I would love to make a music video. And she had a public Instagram, had a great portfolio and did mostly narrative short films, and I loved her previous work, and she's about my age, and I immediately trusted her. I was like, okay, this seems like it's gonna work. So we Zoomed several times. She's based in LA, I'm based here in Seattle, and when I came down to LA to record “Shapeshifting,” and we met for drinks. Then we just started building the team out from there. She came up with the concept based on everything we talked about around the song, what it was about, and we had a bunch of brainstorming sessions before we locked [the final] concept in. And I agree, I think it's really creative on her part. I love the ideas that she had, and everything, every decision she made was very calculated and strategic. The ending scene is obviously my favorite, because I just feel like it's a combination of, you know, obviously it's a montage, so it's a combination of the whole video. I think it just shows the power of friendship and unity and togetherness or love when you're in the middle of shapeshifting and, like, coming back to who you really are and who actually sees you for that.

LUNA: Yeah, I really liked it. Especially the swimming pool scene, it just feels like such queer joy. Simply letting go of these expectations and letting yourself be who you really are. I really liked that.

COCHRANE: Thank you so much! Yeah, I think we wanted to make it kind of ambiguous as to whether or not it was a queer connection or not, because the song itself really isn't queer. I mean, it's written in third person and using she/her pronouns, so it could seem that it is, and I am a queer artist. So we wanted to make it a little bit ambiguous as to whether or not, but it wasn't. We wanted to make it ambiguous because the point of the song isn't that it's a queer song. The point of it is whoever you are, you know, whatever you're doing, focus on what really matters, which is connection and what your values are.

LUNA: This release follows your single “Corporate Ladder,” which is also a very vulnerable track. Do you ever get worried about sharing these emotional songs with people?

COCHRANE: Honestly, not really. I think I used to, but the first song I ever released was a pretty vulnerable track, a pretty emotionally-charged track about somebody I literally met on Tinder. And, like, that's pretty embarrassing [laughs]. But it’s human and, I don't know. I just find comfort when people say, I relate to this so hard. And these lyrics are so relatable, it makes me feel better, because I know I'm not alone in feeling these things. I know I'm not the only one that's wanted to quit her day job and has been frustrated with corporate America, or has shifted on a Saturday night, or has crashed out about somebody they knew for three months. I know that these are common experiences, at least that's what I tell myself. So surprisingly, I don't get that worried about it, being vulnerable.

LUNA: Yeah, honestly, music connects people. So having songs like these is really special. It's reassuring to know that other people go through similar experiences to what we go through. I also want to talk a bit about your single “The Executioner.” I really like the line, “God, help me. I am female.” We all have our interpretation of being a woman, but what does it mean to you?

COCHRANE: It’s a beautiful question. That one is tricky, because I guess when I wrote it, it was one of those things where I felt it really strong, but I wasn't really thinking about what it could mean. And whenever I play it live, I encourage the audience to sing along at the end of the song, and some men will come up and be like, As a cis, straight guy,I felt a little weird singing along at the end. I understand that, but it's a song for everybody. I think everybody has a balance of masculine and feminine in them, and I do think the feminine are the traits of people that get exploited or taken advantage of the most. And that can be in a cis, straight man, it can be in a trans woman, it can be in a trans man, it can be in a cis woman, like it can be in literally anyone. Everybody has divine femininity, and I think that, like your kindness or your sensuality, for example, I feel like those are feminine traits, and I think those things get exploited the most. So I think that the softer, nurturing, emotional qualities of someone is, is the God, help me. I am these things, and I think these are beautiful things, but somebody's taking advantage of them.

LUNA: There's such a refreshing honesty in your lyricism. How do you achieve that? What is your writing process like?

COCHRANE: It honestly kind of feels like I take lines from my journal. I try to journal every day, because I read “The Artist’s Way” a couple times. It's by this woman named Julia Cameron. She wrote it in the ‘80s or ‘90s, I think, so it's pretty dated, but it's all lessons that you can apply 40 years later. And one of them is to write every day, and that's really hard to do with short attention spans and technology at our fingertips. Sometimes I'll do a voice memo journal or something, but I think it's just a matter of being in touch with what's going on, how you're feeling. Being emotionally self aware of how you're feeling, and then just not being afraid to turn those into lyrics.

LUNA: I think you achieve that very well. They feel very authentic and honest, and that's the charm in them.

COCHRANE: Thank you. That means a lot, because I focus most on my lyrics. Like, too much, to the point where it takes too long to finish a song [laughs].

LUNA: I was gonna ask, you talked about “Shapeshifting on a Saturday Night” taking a year and a half, right?

COCHRANE: Yeah, I wrote it not in a year and a half, but from writing to releasing, it's been a year and a half, which was crazy. But, I wrote it in a few days. Honestly, that was one of the quicker songs I've written. I made a demo, and I was still in school last year, so I wanted to save money to record it at a studio. So I went, I came home from school, and I saved. I worked all summer, saved a bunch of money, and then had enough money to record it by November. We recorded it in Nashville, and it sounded really cool. I don't think this version will ever see the light of day, but it's kind of like a full band version. And then I was thinking, well, I want to do a ballad version too, so I want both versions, and then I'll decide. I worked with a producer here in Seattle for a ballad version, and then in January - so this is almost coming up in a year, because I wrote it in March of 2024, but in January of 2025 - I teased the full band version at two times speed, and that went viral. I'm not used to having videos go viral, and some people messaged me, and they were like, You need to re-record this so it's faster and it sounds like a pop song. I actually was working with somebody more connected in the industry, and he reached out and helped me create this at a faster tempo. Josh, he kind of A&R the whole process and got me connected with a pop producer. We spent the last six months making it perfect and making the music video and getting it ready for release, and now the day has finally come.

LUNA: The result is great, honestly. In an interview with Shoutout Miami, you talked about how people shouldn't be frightened of pursuing an artistic career because they're “risky.” Has your mindset changed since then? Or do you still trust that if it’s the right path for you, you should go for it?

COCHRANE: I can remember saying that, and I obviously want to be cautious when I say that, because it seems privileged to be like, Well, no, you should do your art and don't worry, it's going to work out and you're going to survive by just doing your art. But I still do think that like, because I work non-creative jobs throughout the week - I work at a restaurant, I work at a golf course, and I'm currently house sitting right now, so I have like a million different side hustles. In “The Artist’s Way,” it also talks about this a lot where it's like, if you're saying you're too busy, or you're saying you're too broke, or you're saying you're too, you know, busy with the kids or your partner or school, it's just coming up with excuses for your brain not to be creative. So obviously, I understand that pursuing an artistic career is very much a financial risk, and some people do have the means to fully go for it on their own; I didn't for the longest time. I think that everybody has an artist inside them, and you can honor that by spending your downtime, and I need to do this better, not on your phone and not drinking … there's things that distract you and take you out of it.

LUNA: I definitely agree with that. I think it's very important to just follow your passion, and even if it's like, I don't know, taking 30 minutes to one hour a day to do that outside of your job. I think that's still very important to do. So you've been releasing quite consistently. Is there a project, like an EP or album in the works?

COCHRANE: I hope so. I think that I'm so glad that I released all the songs that I did this year, up until “Shapeshifting.” But I think that if I were to make an album, the only singles I've released so far that would carry on to that album would be “Shapeshifting” and “Existential Crisis at The Tennis Club,” just because I think those are my best performing songs and the ones that best match what I'm going to be creating next. So, yes, it's in the works. I think it's just a matter of if I'm going to have enough funding for it. It’s a huge dream of mine to release an album, maybe an EP first, but an album has always been like, I need this. I've got some writing sessions next week in LA, so I'm excited to make some more music.

LUNA: That's exciting, I wish you a lot of luck with that. My last question is, as a singer-songwriter, which other singer-songwriter would you like to collaborate with if you had the chance?

COCHRANE: The pop brain in me wants to say Chappell Roan, like I would just die to collaborate, and I've loved her music since her first EP. My friend in high school put me on to her, and she's like, Oh my god, listen to this. It had just come out, and it was so good. But also, I grew up in the Pacific Northwest, like there's a lot of folk music here. I feel like there's a lot more slower indie stuff here. I think it's an EP, technically, but an album/EP that changed my life was For Emma, Forever Ago by Bon Iver. I think that would be such a cool person to collaborate with. That really, really got something out of me when I first listened to it, I was like, Whoa, this is beautiful. So maybe both, maybe we can all three make a song.

LUNA: That would be a very interesting combination.